Wednesday, July 11, 2018

Missing Part of It, Akin!


Did Arnobius Deny that Celestial Bodies are Alive? · Missing Part of It, Akin!

Are There UFOs in Religious Art? (And More Weird Questions!)
Jimmy Akin | 25.V.2018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdRlhawSvPY


Important extract:



Now, the point is, the tradition was not just an artistic one and Sun and Moon are not just depicted as witnesses. The angels who are moving the celestial bodies are actually, like all other angels, witnesses.

Sun, because he made his celestial body go dark, Moon, because he knew his celestial body cannot have been hiding that of the Sun at Fullmoon.

The Catholic Bible (unlike, I think, KJV, which has a shorter Daniel ch 3), actually has this adress to angels and to Sun and Moon:

[58] O ye angels of the Lord, bless the Lord: praise and exalt him above all for ever. ... [61] O all ye powers of the Lord, bless the Lord: praise and exalt him above all for ever. [62] O ye sun and moon, bless the Lord: praise and exalt him above all for ever. [63] O ye stars of heaven, bless the Lord: praise and exalt him above all for ever.

In other words, yes, some of the angels created presumably all before day Four, on day Four got assigned heavenly bodies to be moving and these were active at the miracle of the Sun going dark. Precisely as also on the miracle of Joshua's long day.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
Pope St Pius I, Martyr
11.VII.2018

Romae sancti Pii Primi, Papae et Martyris; qui martyrio coronatus est in persecutione Marci Aurelii Antonini. Bergomi sancti Joannis Episcopi, qui, ob tuendam catholicam fidem, ab Arianis occisus est. ...

Neanderthal's Language


Dr. Jeffery Laitman, at Mt Sinai school of medicine, in a video argues about as follows:

"the central part of the base is flat" (4:40 in Homo Sapiens vs Neanderthals | The Evolution of Language*) - > so Neanderthals probably had the larynx high up in the throat (like children** and like apes) - > "according to some linguists, they probably coundl't make certain of what we call the quantum vowel sounds ... the sounds in boot, father or feet" (8:11 or so ...)

Now, there is a class of languages where this is less important.

You see they depend mainly on consonants. However, most consonants are not that much affected by size of resonance box or by position of larynx.

This means, any language from this class could be better off as a pre-Flood language than, say, Homeric Greek, which depended on very full vowels. Hawaian is also out.

Now, if the Neanderthals could not get an oo from boot totally distinct from an ee from feet, well, perhaps also the consonants w as in woe and y as in yore were hard to distinguish?

There is one Semitic language (one of the families in the class depending mainly on consonants, there is also a Caucasian family with the trait) where w and y are somewhat interchangeable.

It is, as my mother's language books from back then taught me, so that "waw-yod" confusion in mid radical was one of the features which scared me away from learning Hebrew, well, it is Hebrew.

So, if the general pre-Flood language was Hebrew and if Neanderthals lived pre-Flood, what Jeffery Laitman says of Neanderthal anatomy supports this.

He goes on in the video to argue their brains didn't function as ours, no symbolic behaviour ... well, they don't cave paintings - but those could be from one single genial artist post-Flood, some close kin of Noah, and they could have made some where colours were washed off during Flood. It seems "they invented the hashtag".

They are also arguably behind the bone flute from Divje Babe in Slovenia.

They also buried their dead, it would seem.

They knew how to impregnate wood with a substance so it ignited faster - and you don't get advanced technology without symbolic behaviour.

To a Young Earth Creationist, knowing they had our FoxP2 gene, our Broca's and Wernicke's areas, and that we share in some but not all cases more of their genes or less of their genes, it is obvious they descended from Adam and Eve and could speak.

And what Jeffery Laitman says of their anatomy argues, what they spoke could have been Hebrew.

More, perhaps, tomorrow, on them, today I am a bit tired.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
Pope St Pius I, Martyr***
11.VII.2018

* Homo Sapiens vs Neanderthals | The Evolution of Language
Epic History | 3.I.2016
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9KnOjsc0g4


** He speaks of a "trace of Neanderthal" in all of us, but we are not now considered as evolved from Neanderthals.

*** Romae sancti Pii Primi, Papae et Martyris; qui martyrio coronatus est in persecutione Marci Aurelii Antonini.

Très brièvement sur Deux Aspects de Tito


Je passe de côté les aspects de partisan et de révolutionnaire en 1945 (y compris donc le massacre à Bleiburg), et me concentre sur deux aspects de sa politique.

  • le bon aspect est de prolonger le moment assez bref pro-Koulak de Staline : Tito était toujours plus ou moins pro-Koulak (au-delà d'une certaine grandeur d'exploitation, la coopérative était obligatoire, mais des petits Koulaks, ça a toujours existé - et les produits de Agro-Union ont fait saliver jusqu'en Suède);
  • le mauvais aspect est de prolonger certains moments des aspects culturels et législatifs de mœurs du Léninisme, de prôner Alexandra Kollontaï, l'avortement, la contraception (sans oublier un certain anticléricalisme, beaucoup moins prononcé qu'en Soviétique, mais qui aussi a préféré des Chrétiens sans "querelles doctrinales" ou créationnisme jeune-terre).


Avant de reprocher à Carlos Ugo de s'être prononcé pour le premier aspect, faudrait vérifier s'il était aussi pour le second./HGL

Saturday, July 7, 2018

Newman sur l'avant le Concile de Nicée - et le pendant et l'après


Le converti et cardinal John Henry Newman, avant de devenir catholique, était Anglican.

Déjà pendant cette période, il va écrire un livre qui va préparer sa conversion:

Arians of the Fourth Century
John Henry Newman
http://www.newmanreader.org/works/arians/index.html


Amazon : The Arians of the Fourth Century
Paperback – September 12, 2013 by John Henry Newman (Author)
https://www.amazon.com/Arians-Fourth-Century-Henry-Newman/dp/1230240667


Je pourrais revérifier un peu, car c'est avant de quitter la Suède que je l'ai lu. Et ça fait 14 ans que je ne suis pas allé en Suède.

Ce dont je me souviens, sans problème, c'est la ligne générale:

  • l'église primitive continue bien-sûr après les Apôtres (en cessant d'être qualifiable strictu sensu de "primitive"), ayant sa doctrine par les livres de la Bible et par la succession des évêques,
  • se voit confronté avec une novation simplificatrice, la négation de la distinction réelle entre les trois personnes
  • ce qui est prêché par un Sabellius que l'église condamne bien avant Nicée
  • et la condamnation de Sabellius est reprise en forme exagérée par un Paul de Samosate, aussi condamné avant Nicée
  • et l'église devient légale en Empire romain
  • et en Alexandria, l'évêque Alexandre et son alors Diacre Athanase se voient confrontés avec un Arius, qui reprend la doctrine déjà condamnée de Paul de Samosate
  • Constantin convoque un concile par tout l'empire qui condamne donc en forme un peu plus solennelle qu'avant les erreurs de Paul de Samosate et d'Arius
  • et pour l'instant, l'orthodoxie a gagné, mais ...
  • Constantin meurt, ses fils sont mécontents, pas seulement l'arianisme est relégalisé, mais l'orthodoxie est délégalisé, sous prétexte de fanatisme, et St. Athanase, devenu évêque après Alexandre, est remplacé par l'intrus Georges, doit continuer en clandestin, est exilé à Trèves (49° 45′ 35″ nord, 6° 38′ 38″ est, ville natale de Karl Marx, en Allemagne actuelle - ce qui prouve une romanité pour la nationalité germanique, dans ces région frontalières), divers d'autres reprennent la lutte contre l'arianisme aussi, dont certains sont aussi persécutés, certains diffèrent sur le combien on doit condamner en l'arianisme (Lucifer étant un hardliner et les homoïousiens étant considérés par St. Athanase comme voulant dire la même chose, par lui sont considérés comme Ariens - certains seront plus tard pères de l'église), certains d'autres cèdent à la pression (pape Libère, Hosius de Cordoue), malgré une orthodoxie personnelle,
  • et enfin après Julien l'Apostat et un nouvel Empereur catholique, les choses reviennent en ordre, dans le deuxième concile général, celui qui était le premier à Constantinople.


Après de vérifier un peu du texte en ligne, il semble que l'église d'Antioche (d'où était Paul de Samosate et d'où sera plus tard Nestorius) et les Juifs avaient de quoi à faire avec les erreurs pré-ariens et ariens. Et - ce que j'avais totalement oublié - le Montanisme et le Gnosticisme avec le Sabellianisme.

Il y a une histoire très bien documentée, on peut à la limite être en discorde avec tel ou tel détail, ou comment interpréter telle ou telle partie communément admise, et dans cette histoire, il n'y a pas de trace d'une certaine idiotie, selon laquelle le Christianisme aurait au début reconnu Jésus-Christ comme simple prophète, comme simplement un homme inspiré par Dieu et ensuite l'idée de sa divinité serait imposée par politique sur le concile de Nicée, venant de nulle part. Au contraire, les Ariens aussi reconnaissaient Jésus-Christ comme beaucoup plus qu'un simple prophète, comme la première créature, créé avant que Dieu crée tout le reste (avec lui, probablement).

Arius, très au contraire, ne semble pas avoir pleinement reconnu l'humanité de Notre Seigneur. St Thomas d'Aquin dit en III Pars, Q5, A3, début du corpus:

I answer that, As Augustine says (De Haeres. 69,55), it was first of all the opinion of Arius and then of Apollinaris that the Son of God assumed only flesh, without a soul, holding that the Word took the place of a soul to the body. And consequently it followed that there were not two natures in Christ, but only one; for from a soul and body one human nature is constituted. But this opinion cannot hold


Ou plutôt il dit:

Respondeo dicendum quod, sicut Augustinus dicit, in libro de haeresibus, opinio primo fuit Arii, et postea Apollinaris, quod filius Dei solam carnem assumpserit, absque anima, ponentes quod verbum fuerit carni loco animae. Ex quo sequebatur quod in Christo non fuerunt duae naturae, sed una tantum, ex anima enim et carne una natura humana constituitur. Sed haec positio stare non potest,


Ce que je pourrais traduire comme: je réponds qu'on doit dire que, comme le dit Augustine dans le livre sur les hérésies, l'opinion fut d'abord celle d'Arius et ensuite celle d'Apollinaire, que le Fils de Dieu prit seulement la chair, sans l'âme, posant que pour la chair le Verbe était en lieu d'âme. De quoi suivrait que dans le Christ il n'y avait pas deux natures, mais une seulement, car d'âme et de chair une nature humaine est constituée. Mais cette opinion ne peut pas rester debout ... Et ensuite, il donne trois raisons contre Arius. Le point est donc, Arius n'était absolument pas quelqu'un qui prenait le Christ comme un homme ayant une grâce spéciale de Dieu, il le prenait pour quelque chose comme la première créature. La conscience qui habitait le corps de Notre Seigneur n'aurait même pas compris une âme normale, mais été uniquement cet être "presque éternel" qu'Arius voulait au lieu d'un Fils parfaitement coéternel avec le Père.

Pour nous, cette personne comporte deux consciences, celle qu'Il a de toute éternité, celle qui débute dans le sein de la Vierge. En restant une même personne.

Franchement, la formule de Nicée n'ajoute pas sensiblement pour un lecteur très superficielle à ce qu'Arius disait, elle est plus compliqué, ce n'aurait pas été génial de l'inventer pour des raisons politiques, et de fait, la politique va l'opposer, d'abord sous Constantin II (Occident), Constant Ier (Centre), Constance II (Orient) qui favorisèrent l'Arianisme, ensuite par Julien qui favorisait un retour au paganisme (pas de bol, pour lui, la littérature païenne était Homère et Virgile, la philosophie par contre très différente de leurs croyances, ou réellement celles d'Homère ... et trop de gens étaient déjà Chrétiens) et encore une fois la politique des Visigoths, en moindre mesure aussi Ostrogoths et Burgondiens, en mesure acerbée la politique des Vandales va persécuter le Catholicisme. De ça, par contre, Newman ne traite pas, au-delà de Julien et du Concile de Constantinople.

Mais on espère que personne aurait sérieusement prétendu le contraire ... non?

Hans Georg Lundahl
Cergy
Sts Cyrille et Méthode
7.VII.2018

Sunday, June 24, 2018

Date carbonique 3200 avant Jésus-Christ - trop tôt pour Amorrhéens?


New blog on the kid : Abraham et Ein-Gedi selon Genèse 14 - et carbone 14 · Φιλολoγικά/Philologica : Date carbonique 3200 avant Jésus-Christ - trop tôt pour Amorrhéens? · New blog on the kid : Ma dernière table sur les datations de carbone 14 · Carbone 14

Les sources les plus anciennes concernant les Amorrites, vers -2400, parlent de la « terre des Amorrites » (terre de mar.tu), qui est associée avec les terres à l'ouest de l'Euphrate, incluant Canaan et la Syrie actuelle. Les textes sumériens, akkadiens, et assyriens les décrivent comme un peuple nomade, « non civilisé », lié en particulier à une région montagneuse situé au nord ouest de la Syrie, au sud de Rakka et à l'ouest de Deir-es-Zor, le Djebel Bichri (Jabal Bishri), appelé également montagne des Amorrites. Vers le milieu du IIIe millénaire av. J.-C., ils commencent à migrer, peut-être pour des raisons de changement climatique, et se répandent en Syrie, puis vers la Mésopotamie.


Ceci selon la wikipédie.

Mais il semble que:

  • on n'a pas de plus anciennes sources sumériennes qui appellent le pays à l'Ouest de l'Euphrate autre chose que Mar-tu;

  • ces anciennes sources de Sumer, étant datés plus ou moins carboniquement (voir en bas) à 2400 avant Jésus-Christ sont probablement donc postérieures aux événements de Genèse 14 qui devraient être datables à vers 3200 avant Jésus-Christ.


En fait, les premières sources écrites que nous avons de tout sont datées (plus ou moins carboniquement) à environ 2600 avant Jésus-Christ.

Et ceci devrait être la date carbonique pour la date réelle vers 1700 et quelque avant Jésus-Christ, c'est à dire le temps de Joseph en Égypte.

Donc, cette grande expansion amorrhéenne en place en "2400 avant Jésus-Christ" devrait être à la fois après les défaites en Genèse 14 (une défaite qui leur aurait donné soif de revanche envers la Mésopotamie) et après le départ de la maisonnée de Jacob en Égypte.

Maintenant, à ce "plus ou moins carboniquement".

Une tablette en argile ne serait pas en elle-même datable par carbone 14, j'imagine, et en plus on voudra la laisser intacte. Mais, en même temps, elle peut être supposée contemporaine avec l'étagère ou la bibliothèque où elle se trouve, elle pourrait aussi être datable par un roi, par rapport à une postérité qui elle à la fois est daté par carbone et donne une fiable (ou moins fiable) datation relative des événements d'un passé proche (ou même moins proche).

Par contre - les dynasties des Mésopotamiens ou des Égyptiens n'ont pas fait l'objet d'une systématique indigène comparable à la suite des régimes en Grèce depuis Cécrops l'autochtone ou à Rome à partir d'Énée ou de Romulus ... et même ces systématiques là sont de nos jours mises en doute par pas mal de savant.

Je qualifie : une systématique unique canonique et mise en relation avec les régimes des Hébreux, Grecs ou Romains, de qui nous avons une chronologie.

DONC, pas mal de cette datation relève de carbone 14, ET, si (comme je viens de rendre probable pour Genèse 13 et 14) la datation est décalée par un niveau inférieur, alors, les dates sont trop peu récentes.

Je recite la wiki:

La période qui s'étend de 2000 à 1595 est d'ailleurs parfois nommée « Période amorrite ». Elle est marquée par de nombreuses rivalités entre les différents royaumes amorrites, bien connues par les archives retrouvées sur le site de Mari. Après la domination de Isin, puis de Larsa au sud mésopotamien, et celle du royaume de Yamkhad (Alep), face à son rival Qatna, puis la domination éphémère du roi Samsî-Addu, originaire d'Ekallatum, ce sont finalement le Yamkhad à l'ouest et Babylone (sous le règne d'Hammourabi) à l'est qui se partagent le Proche-Orient dans la seconde moitié du xviiie siècle av. J.-C. après avoir dominé successivement tous leurs adversaires. Mais ils ne savent pas assurer leur hégémonie, et le xviie siècle av. J.-C. verra leur affaiblissement, et l'éclatement de ces deux ensembles, qui seront finalement éliminés par des raids lancés par le roi hittite Mursili Ier autour de 1600. Après cela, les royaumes amorrites sont supplantés par l'établissement de nouveaux ensembles dirigés par de nouvelles ethnies, les Hittites, les Kassites et surtout les Hourrites.


La date réelle de l'Exode étant 1510 avant Jésus-Christ, et un décalage d'environ un siècle restant à cette époque (un peu plus vers la naissance de Moïse, si Sésostris III était le Pharaon qui ordonnait l'infanticide), il se suit que la date du déclin des Amorrhéens pourrait très bien coïncider avec la conquête par Josué, 40 ans après l'Exode, 1470 avant Jésus-Christ.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Kremlin-Bicêtre
St Jean-Baptiste
24.VI.2018

Wednesday, June 20, 2018

Did Arnobius Deny that Celestial Bodies are Alive?


Did Arnobius Deny that Celestial Bodies are Alive? · Missing Part of It, Akin!

I have seen Arnobius quoted like this:

Arnobius: The moon, the sun, the earth, the ether, the stars, are members and parts of the world; but if they are parts and members, they are certainly not themselves living creatures (Arnobius Against the Heathen, Book 3, 350)


Here : Philip Stallings : The Biblical Flat Earth: Quotes Of The Early Church Fathers And Protestant Reformers
http://www.philipstallings.com/2015/07/the-biblical-flat-earth-early-church.html


Most, perhaps even all of his quotes on Church Fathers are compatible with Earth being round. Their point is rather Geocentrism. But the point of this one seems more to be to deny that celestial bodies are alive.

Now, I looked up

Arnobius Against the Heathen Book III
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/06313.htm


And this is what I found:

35. Men worthy to be remembered in the study of philosophy, who have been raised by your praises to its highest place, declare, with commendable earnestness, as their conclusion, that the whole mass of the world, by whose folds we all are encompassed, covered, and upheld, is one animal possessed of wisdom and reason; yet if this is a true, sure, and certain opinion, they also will immediately cease to be gods whom you set up a little ago in its parts without change of name. For as one man cannot, while his body remains entire, be divided into many men; nor can many men, while they continue to be distinct and separate from each other, be fused into one sentient individual: so, if the world is a single animal, and moves from the impulse of one mind, neither can it be dispersed in several deities; nor, if the gods are parts of it, can they be brought together and changed into one living creature, with unity of feeling throughout all its parts. The moon, the sun, the earth, the ether, the stars, are members and parts of the world; but if they are parts and members, they are certainly not themselves living creatures; for in no thing can parts be the very thing which the whole is, or think and feel for themselves, for this cannot be effected by their own actions, without the whole creature's joining in; and this being established and settled, the whole matter comes back to this, that neither Sol, nor Luna, nor Aether, Tellus, and the rest, are gods. For they are parts of the world, not the proper names of deities; and thus it is brought about that, by your disturbing and confusing all divine things, the world is set up as the sole god in the universe, while all the rest are cast aside, and that as having been set up vainly, uselessly, and without any reality.


So, the real context is Arnobius confronting diverse Pagan ideas, and here his point was, Pantheism (clearly one of them) or Panpsychism (another of them, the one here adressed) excludes Moon and Sun being different gods from each other, since they would rather in that case be parts of the same god.

In the previous, he has argued from identification of diverse goddesses with the Moon, that they cannot be different goddesses though usually considered so. Luna or Selene cannot be Diana or Artemis in mythology, but if both are same celestial body, one of the goddesses is out. (Not sure how he or Aristotle argued for Minerva or Pallas Athenâ being yet another moon goddess.)

Now, if the passage quoted by Philip Stallings actually has previously been cited in such isolation, this could be the reason why Bishop Tempier condemned and St Thomas Aquinas rejected celestial bodies being alive. St Thomas also has another reason, no change being observed in any celestian body, and change being necessary for bodily life. We have seem some of them have changing processes since, like the protuberances of the Sun, the whirl on Jupiter, the clouds on Venus. And a flickering of certain fix stars, often now attributed to exoplanets even when these have not been sighted as actual globes.

Either way, as long as the condemnation stands (in Paris and England, presumably therefore also in certain colonies), angelic movers clearly are an option, though, equally as per bishop Tempier, we cannot say each angel is angelic mover of a celestial body, only presume each celestial body may have an angelic mover. Some angels do have other business, like adoring God well above stars (as Seraphim and Cherubim do) or helping men down here on earth.

To return to Philip Stalling, I was just revising the symbolic meaning of alimentary cashroot about mammalian meats. A mammal with several digits (dogs, hares, bears ...) refers to diversity of Pagan doctrine, none of it from authority of both Testaments. A mammal with one uncloven hoof (horse and donkeys) refers to infidelity of accepting only one of the Testaments. A mammal with cloven hoof, but not completely cloven (camel) refers to infidelity or heresy of those confusing the testaments (7 Day Adventists come to mind since applying OT Sabbath in NT times, Calvinists seem to think the comment against images still applies after God took a body which was visible and depictable since Bethlehem). Pure mammals have perfectly cloven hooves (oxen, sheep, goats, elk, deer). They also ruminate. Perfectly cloven hoof refers to accepting both Testaments and them being distinct and ruminating to meditating the truth in prayer. Pigs also have perfectly cloven hooves, but do NOT ruminate, and that refers to Catholics who while accepting the truth do not meditate it by prayer.

Well, there is an OT ritual rule about four corners. Imagine you have a poncho with a tassel in each corner. You would be literally fulfilling that law to the letter (literally and to the letter mean the same thing). Now, you may spread your poncho on the ground (like drying it after rain or washing). When it lies on the ground, the poncho forms sth very close to a real square or rectangle, the Euclidean flat figure properly so called. But that is not how you used the poncho. When you wear it, it still has four corners, but they are around your (sometimes very round, as Chesterton would observe) body. A real or Euclidean square suddenly has become a Riemann figure, often called Riemann "square" because Riemann had no time to find more specific names for the figures than borrowing and misusing the names already taken by Euclid.

Well, the one other thing in the Bible which again and again has "four corners" is Earth or Land. I think sth like Cape of Good Hope or Cape Horn qualifies as a "corner" of the Land, since North of it the Sea is to the West (West and East for Horn), East of it, the Sea is to the South. This remains so even if it is on a globe. So, either of the named Capes in my view would be the South West Corner of the world in the Biblical sense of Four Corners. And Earth as a whole (not Land) actually being round is supported by your body, if ever you wear a poncho.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
Pope St Silverius
20.VI.2018

Tuesday, June 12, 2018

If you read old texts - did people really do things like that back then?


Some seem to have doubts. Back when men had hats, did they really take off their hat to a lady?

Or did someone write that just for the story?

Would Sir Walter Raleigh really have put his cape under the feet of "Queen Elizabeth" (or Usurper and Tyrant Elizabeth Boleyn, as some decent people would prefer to call her)? Or was that imagined just to show off a man who probably behaved like a fat boss in office drinking too much coffee from morning to evening (perhaps even more than I do!)?

Well, there was a Scottish lass, and she went to "America" (I think she meant US of, not Mexico or Canada, since the cities she mentioned were Boston and New York). She looked at red fire hydrants in an oval 8 shape, at cicular man holes and not square ones and at yellow taxis.

"that I've seen in the movies and I was ... they don't just make this up for cinema, this is actually how these people do things"


I suppose those who have grown up with only one language in childhood are also surprised that someone is actually speaking that foreign language with apparent fluency and reacting to their own language with either complete incomprehension or a surprising lack of fluency. Yeah, right, speaking another language than my own is not a show you put on, it really happens (it even happens you speak "dead languages" fluently, but in that case, if many people do so and you are not one in perhaps 15 archaeologists in the world who are fluent at Hittite, it is preferrable to speak of "classic language" or "learned language").

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre University Library
St John of St Facundus
12.VI.2018

PS, this post of mine includes comment on work that is her copyright, this could perhaps not be done any more if a certain paragraph 13 passed:

https://saveyourinternet.eu/

Tuesday, June 5, 2018

Mariages entre St Louis IX et Françoise de Rohan : une lignée


Et il s'agit comme sur l'étude anglophone, plus grande mais moins complète, des premiers mariages pour chaque personne concernée, donc, un homme ayant épousé deux vierges va compter pour un premier mariage d'un homme (son premier) et deux premiers mariages de femmes (ceux des deux femmes). Comme là, ma source est la wikipédie:

  • 28 mai 1262 à Clermont-Ferrand - Philippe III[1], dit « le Hardi » (Poissy, 1er mai 1245 – Perpignan, 5 octobre 1285) ~ Isabelle d'Aragon (1247-1271)
  • Le 21 août 1274 à Vincennes - Philippe III épousa en secondes noces Marie de Brabant (1254-1321)

  • Le 14 août 1284, Philippe (né à Fontainebleau en avril/juin 1268 – mort à Fontainebleau le 29 novembre 1314) épouse à l'âge de 16 ans Jeanne Ire de Navarre (reine de Navarre de 1274 à 1305)(née le 14 janvier 1273 à Bar-sur-Seine, Champagne - morte le 2 avril 1305 à Vincennes, France)

  • En 1305 Louis X[1], dit « le Hutin » (c'est-à-dire « l'entêté[2] »), né le 4 octobre 1289 à Paris, mort le 5 juin 1316 à Vincennes a épousé Marguerite de Bourgogne (1290-1315)
  • En 1315, Louis épouse Clémence de Hongrie (née en 1293 - morte le 12 octobre 1328 à Paris)

  • Le 18 juin 1318, Jeanne (28 janvier 1311 – 6 octobre 1349) épouse Philippe III d'Évreux, (en basque : Filipe, en espagnol : Felipe ; 27 mars 1306 - 16 septembre 1343) [le mariage fut consommé 6 ou 7 ans plus tard?]

  • 1338 : Marie d'Évreux, née en 1330 et morte le 29 avril 1347 à Valence épouse le 25 juillet 1338 à Alagón Pierre IV le Cérémonieux, né le 5 octobre 1319 à Balaguer et mort le 5 janvier 1387 à Barcelone.

  • 1361 : Constance d'Aragon (1343-1363), mariée en 1361 au roi Frédéric III de Sicile, (né le 1er septembre 1341 à Catane, et mort à Messine, 27 janvier 1377)
  • Le 17 janvier 1372, Frédéric III de Sicile épouse en secondes noces Antonia des Baux/Antonia del Balzo (1355 circa – Messina, 23 gennaio 1374)

  • 1390 : En 1380, Pierre IV donna la vicairerie de l'île à son fils l'infant Martin d'Aragon, dont Marie* épousa en 1390 le fils, un autre Martin d'Aragon (1375-1409), dit « le jeune ».
    • * Marie Ire, reine de Sicile, est née le 2 juillet 1363 à Catane et décédée le 25 mai 1401 à Lentini.
  • 1403 : Le 25 mai 1402, la reine Marie meurt, instituant son époux pour son héritier. L'année suivante Martin se remarie avec Blanche de Navarre, fille du roi Charles III, née le 6 juillet 1387 et morte le 1er avril 1441 à Santa María la Real de Nieva, Castille.

  • En 1438, Charles d'Aragon (1421-1461) épousa Agnès de Clèves (1422-1448) qui mourut en 1448 sans lui laisser d'enfants.

  • Sa soeur:
    • 1440 : Blanche de Navarre (1424-1464) a épousé Henri IV de Castille, né à Valladolid en 1425, mort à Madrid en 1474, en 1440 mais le mariage n'a jamais été consommé. Après 13 ans, Henri a voulu divorcer. Un examen officiel a alors confirmé la non-consommation du mariage. Le Pape accorda alors le divorce sous prétexte qu'un acte de sorcellerie avait empêché la consommation du mariage. Blanche a été renvoyée chez elle, où sa famille l'emprisonna. Elle est décédée en 1464 à Orthez n'ayant jamais eu d'enfant.
    • 1455 : Le couple n’a pas d'enfants, et, en 1453, le pape Nicolas V accepte d’annuler le mariage pour non-consommation. Deux ans plus tard, il épouse en secondes noces Jeanne de Portugal, née en 1438, morte en 1475.


  • Encore une soeur:
    • Le 22 décembre 1434, Éléonore de Navarre, née le 2 février 1425 à Olite, morte le 12 février 1479 à Tudela, épouse le comte de Foix Gaston IV (1425-1472), de la maison de Grailly.

    • Le 7 mars 1461 à Saint-Macaire (Gironde), Gaston de Foix (1444 - 23 novembre 1470, Libourne) épouse Madeleine de France (1443-1495), fille du roi de France Charles VII.

    • 1484; janvier : Catherine de Navarre, née en 1468 et morte en 1517 à Mont-de-Marsan, épousa Jean III d'Albret né à Ségur en 1469, mort à Monein le 17 juin 1516, en janvier 1484, elle fut couronnée le même mois avec son mari à Pampelune, capitale de la Navarre.

    • 21 janvier 1527, Henri II de Navarre (1503-1555) épouse Marguerite de Navarre, appelée également Marguerite d’Angoulême ou Marguerite d'Alençon, est née le 11 avril 1492 à Angoulême et morte le 21 décembre 1549 à Odos-en-Bigorre.

    • le 16 août 1534 : Isabeau d'Albret, infante de Navarre, née en Béarn en 1513; morte en 1555; épouse à Fontainebleau le 16 août 1534 René Ier de Rohan né en 1516 et décédé le 20 octobre 1552 à Metz

    • et j'arrête devant l'article Françoise de Rohan


Elle
07 08 09 11 15 15 16 16 16 16 17 17 18 18 20 21 22 27 35
07 08 09 11 15 15 15 15 16 16 16 17 17 18 20 21 22 27 35
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19

Médiane à #10 : 16 ans.
Quartile basse entre #5 et #6, 15 ans.
Quartile haute entre #14 et #15, entre 18 et 20 ans (19 ans).
Minimum 7, la consommation différée quelques ans, et maximum 35 (pas sûr si c'est un premier mariage, je devrais revérifier).

Lui
09 10 12 15 15 15 16 16 17 17 17 18 20 24
09 10 12 14 15 15 15 16 16 17 17 18 20 24
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14

Médiane entre #7 et #8,
compte haut 16, compte bas entre 15 et 16 ans.
Quartile basse à #4, 15 ou 14 ans, selon les comptes.
Quartile haute à #11, 17 ans les deux comptes.
Les deux comptes aussi, le minimum 9 et le maximum 24.

Tuesday, May 29, 2018

La Fayette vs Wilberforce


Je viens de lire un livre sur La Fayette, écrit en 1983, bicentenaire de la paix de Paris ... il y a beaucoup des choses dans ce franc-maçon qui sont bons, par exemple le fait de pouvoir accepter une armée d'amateurs (je me demande si ce sera utile contre Varadkar bientôt), par exemple, à différence de moi, de pouvoir vivre avec une telle armée, vivre la vie de caserne ... mais, quand il a demandé à George Washington la libération des esclaves, celui il lui dit que "le temps n'est pas encore venu" et La Fayette accepte.

Les Anglais, ils ont eu une inspiration autre que La Fayette, autre que la maçonnerie, pour une libération autre que la politique d'un territoire vis-à-vis une métropole : Wilberforce.

Si George Washington avait son La Fayette, George Rex avait son Wilberforce. En 1807 la traite d'esclaves est aboli. Vrai, les États-Unis l'écoutent aussi et l'abolissent l'année suivante, 1808. Mais l'émancipation des Africains déjà mis en esclavage, non, là il y a une nette différence. Wilberforce meurt en 1833 en ayant la satisfaction que le parlement et le roi Guillaume IV abolissent l'esclavage. La Fayette s'est fait aduler par des États-Unis qui, dans le Sud, avaient encore esclaves, et là, l'esclavage sera aboli en 1865, après une guerre.

La Fayette était, avec son beaupère, franc-maçon. Wilberforce aussi était hérétique, mais un peu plus proche de la foi catholique : il était Anglican ... comme Mozart, il aura six enfants avec sa femme en dix ans - mais ça ne s'arrête pas parce qu'il meurt, mais parce que sa femme a trente. Ou parce qu'il perd sa santé.

Despite the urgings of friends to slow down, the couple married at the Church of St Swithin in Bath, Somerset, on 30 May 1797. They were devoted to each other, and Barbara was very attentive and supportive to Wilberforce in his increasing ill health, though she showed little interest in his political activities. They had six children in fewer than ten years: William (b. 1798), Barbara (b. 1799), Elizabeth (b. 1801), Robert Isaac Wilberforce (b. 1802), Samuel Wilberforce (b. 1805) and Henry William Wilberforce (b. 1807). Wilberforce was an indulgent and adoring father who revelled in his time at home and at play with his children.


Malgré les amis qui les poussent à attendre, le couple fut marié à l'église de St Swithin (Saint Swithun, évêque catholique de Winchester entre 853 et 865), en Bath, Somerset, le 30 Mai 1797. Ils s'adoraient, et Barbara fit très attentive et d'un grand soutien à Wilberforce, dans sa santé de plus en plus mauvaise, même si elle montrait peu d'intérêt dans ses activités politiques. Ils eurent six enfants en moins de dix ans: William (né 1798), Barbara (née 1799), Robert Isaac Wilberforce (né 1802), Samuel Wilberforce (né 1805) et Henry William Wilberforce (né 1807). Wilberforce était un père dévôt et indulgent qui aimait son temps à la maison et en jouant avec ses enfants.

Bon, pour Wilberforce, le maître à penser n'était pas un vénérable franc-maçon, ni autre franc-maçon, mais un converti du péché, un John Newton : déserteur puni de la marine royale (il fut fouetté en bord HMS Harwich), embauché sur un navire négrier, le Pegasus, laissé avec un négrier en Afrique, Amos Clowe, qui le faisait esclave aussi, à son tour, de sa femme la princesse Peye, une Sherbro. Il fut sauvé de l'esclavage par un navire anglais, et sauvé d'un naufrage menaçant à Donegal, en 1748 ... comme Saint Patrick, lui ayant été un esclave chez les irlandais, il crie à Dieu de l'aider, et il semble que ça ait plu à St Patrick de s'unir à cette prière. Il fut sauvé du naufrage, et il devint un Anglican évangéliste.

Il faut savoir, "évangéliste" n'est pas une confession, comme Anglican ou Lutherien ou Calviniste, c'est une mouvance. Donc, il peut en y avoir chez les Anglicans comme chez les Baptistes ou Pentecôtistes. En termes catholiques, les évangélistes sont un peu Saint-Sulpiciens ou quasi dévots du Sacré-Coeur - mais en dehors de l'église. Et moins la piété mariale et la doctrine catholique du Saint Sacrement. Et puisque John Newton est évangéliste, Wilberforce le sera aussi. Mais revenons à ses enfants.

L'ainé et les deux filles semblent peu connus de l'histoire, au moins ils n'ont pas d'article de la wikipédie, les trois fils qui viennent après sont par contre très bien connus.

Robert et Henry sont convertis catholiques et écrivains (le très connu John Henry Newman est également converti des évangélistes au catholicisme, à delai, à travers les anglo-catholiques), et Samuel est le débatteur créationniste qui oppose Huxley.

Ceci pour deux choses ...

  • quand j'ai lu le livre sur La Fayette qui se trouvait dans une laverie en quartier Mouffetard quelques heures après mon arrivée, j'ai voulu faire une comparaison entre La Fayette et Wilberforce, donc leurs monarques élus ou dynastiques George Washington et George Rex, et en final aussi Doctor Johnson, le Tory auparavant Jacobite et son ami Samuel Boswell, le Whig ... c'est Boswell qui soutenait l'esclavage, pas Johnson;

  • et ce matin, je trouve qu'un article de Jonathan Sarfati vient d'être traduit en français, le voici:

    Laisse partir mon peuple
    par Jonathan Sarfati
    traduit par Paulin et Claire Bédard
    https://creation.com/let-my-people-go-french


Il omet de dire que deux fils de Wilberforce se convertissent au catholicisme (l'ainé aussi?) mais par contre sait très bien qu'un de leurs frères opposa Huxley. Et merci pour m'introduire à John Newton, je ne connaissait pas son histoire de tout, et ce que j'écris ici vient en partie de cet article et en partie de la wikipédie.

Hans Georg Lundahl
BU de Nanterre
St. Restitut, martyr à via Aurelia
29.V.2018

Articles de la wikipédies consultés : Wilberforce (page d'Homonymie), William Wilberforce, Swithun, Slavery Abolition Act 1833, Amazing Grace (2006 film), John Newton, Sherbro people.

PS, cet article est désormais accessible sur l'adresse abrégée http://ppt.li/3yv - quand j'aurais trouvé le livre sur La Fayette et inscrit cet URL abrégé, je pourrais en bonne conscience la laisser dans une laverie./HGL

PPS, un titre plus exacte aurait été "Wilberforce (vs La Fayette)" - mais tant pis!

Friday, May 25, 2018

Age at first marriage : a rough estimate


France St Louis IX to Louis XI : Part I · Part II · Part III · Part IV · Part V
Stats: Age at death · Age at first marriage : a rough estimate

I broke off a first try after 11 each, ladies and gentlemen, and here is the reason:

Here is my old stats on Inés de la Cerda:

Inés de la Cerda (Spain, 1307 - 24 October 1339), Lady of Bembibre. Married Fernán Rodríguez de Villalobos, Lord of Villalobos. She was buried in the monastery of San Francisco de Villafranca, near Valcárcel.


Here I find sth different:

Inés de la Cerda (España, 1307–1362),24​ I señora de Bembibre. Contrajo matrimonio con Fernán Rodríguez (o Ruiz) de Villalobos, señor de Villalobos (1349).24​ Fue sepultada junto con su esposo en el Monasterio de Santa Clara de Villalobos en Zamora que juntos habían fundado en 1348.24​28​ Su hijo Fernán Rodríguez de Villalobos sucedió a su padre como señor de Villalobos y murió soltero antes de 1356. En su testamento, otorgado el 13 de marzo de 1356, Inés declaró que ya era viuda y que no tenía ningún sucesor, salvo su hija Blanca: «Et porque, mal pecado, el dicho Fernán Rodríguez e sus fijos son finados e non fincó dél por la línea derecha, salvo Doña Branca, nuestra fija. Et porque, mal pecado, la dicha Doña Branca es tollida e tal que non puede aver fijos nin esperançá que los pueda aver.» En 1354 había otorgado otro testamento donde decía que su hijo Fernán tenía menos de catorce años, y ya para 1356, año en que otorgó el otro testamento, Fernán había muerto sin haber dejado ninguna descendencia, legítima o ilegítima.2


If she married in 1349 (at 42, as I marked), and died in 1362, she cannot have also died in 1339.

Then I decide a new try. Looking less at wikipedia to get less confused by conflicting indications, just take what I had in previous posts as an estimate (yes, some wikis could be wrong, but hardly most or all of them). I will however be glancing at wiki in the following and I will NOT complete it.

Before you look at it : the legal marriage age was 14 / 12, but sometimes betrothals before that were given the ritual paraphernalia of marriage and count as marriage, even if it is not so in the eyes of the Church. Obviously, a marriage concluded when the bride was 7 was not immediately consummated, they waited (this sometimes happened even when they were above legal age limit, St Bridget of Vadstena was married at 13, but the marriage was consumed when she was 14 - but that case is outside this dynasty, I think).

Ladies :

10 at unknown age.

Age
07 07 09 10 10 10 11 12 12 13 14 14 14 15 15 15 15 15 15
Number
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19

Age
15 15 15 15 15 15 15 16 16 16 16 16 16 16 17 17 17 17 18
Number
20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38

Age
18 18 18 18 18 19 19 19 19 19 19 19 20 20 21 22 22 23 23 24
Number
39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58


Median 16, lower quartile 15, upper quartile 19.

A shorter count with just 57 also gave same result: Median 16, lower quartile 15, upper quartile 19.

Gentlemen:

17 at unknown age

Here we start with the shorter count:

Age
11 11 14 15 16 17 19 20 20 20 20 20
Number
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12

Age
20 20 20 20 22 22 23 23 23 23 23
Number
13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23

Age
24 25 25 26 28 28 28 29 29 29 29 29
Number
24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35

Age
30 30 30 34 34 34 35 36 39 40 49
Number
36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46


Median 23/24, lower quartile 20, upper quartile 29. A longer count with 47 men instead gave Median 23, lower quartile 20, upper quartile 29.

I broke off counting at "In November 1384 Henry himself married Marie de Coucy, [who was 18] Countess of Soissons (1366–1405), daughter of Enguerrand VII Count of Soissons & Sire de Coucy, by his first wife Princess Isabella of England, eldest daughter of King Edward III. Marie became Dame de Coucy et de Oisy following her father's death in 1397."

I had the impression I had already counted that couple, so longer count has one man more with age 22 and one lady more with age 18. And I broke off not to get a whole series of doubles.

In case you wonder why the ladies are in total 67 or 68 and the gentlemen in total 63 or 64, some men whose first marriage only counts once were first or only bridegroom for more than one lady.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
Ember Friday of Pentecost
25.V.2018

Thursday, May 24, 2018

On the Prophecy (if genuine) of Holzhauser


Found this on a site inimical to Catholic prophecy - but citing it in a way which could seem correct:

Hollzhauser (died 1658): "When everything has been ruined by war; when Catholics are hard pressed by traitorous coreligionists and heretics; when the Church and her servants are denied their rights, the monarchies have been abolished and their rulers murdered ... then the hand of Almighty God will work a marvelous change, something apparently impossible according to human understanding.

“There will rise a valiant monarch anointed by God. He will be a Catholic, a descendant of Louis IX, (yet) a descendant of an ancient imperial German family, born in exile. ..."


Found this on Wikipedia:

Louis IV (German: Ludwig; 1 April 1282 – 11 October 1347), called the Bavarian, of the house of Wittelsbach, was King of the Romans from 1314, King of Italy from 1327, and Holy Roman Emperor from 1328.


In Holzhauser's time, the Wittelsbachs had not been Emperors for centuries, so, they can be considered as a precisely "ancient" imperial German family.

Now, why the focus on Louis IV?

His wife was Margaret II Hainaut /I of Holland, whose mother was Joan of Valois, whose father Charles of Valois was son of Philip III of France who was himself son and successor of King Saint Louis IX.

Since Holzhauser was born in the See of Augsburg, later attached to ... Bavaria ... in 1806, back then an independent unit of administration, with a Bishop under the Emperor, but close enough to Bavaria, since he was bookish as a child, it cannot be ruled out that he knew that the Wittelsbachs were both ancient Imperial and ... Royal French. He died after the execution of Charles I, and he had foreseen it in a vision presented in 1646 to the Emperor and the Bavarian Elector (that work of personal prophecy could be what is cited above, unless it was his comment on the Apocalypse), but the English Civil War had been going on since 1642 then. However, it is at least good (and ultimately accurate) analysis that the monarchies were going to be abolished and the kings were going to be murdered : Charles I, Gustave III, Louis XVI, Louis II of Bavaria (disputed, some claiming the official Prussian explanation of his accidentally killing himself by confusion leading to drowning, I'm not buying that), and Nicolas II of Russia, five or at least four monarchs murdered, or wait, there was a Czar before Nicolas II too, Alexander of Yugoslavia, a conspiracy theorist could claim his son Peter II was killed by doctors (but attempting a liver transplant was in a way making himself a kind of killer too), and his brother's death by suicide is a but suspicious too (if he had been a suicide, would the Orthodox allow him burial in Church?) while the assassination of Mihailo Obrenović III in 1868 is not any more dubious than that of Alexander ... there is another question whether all monarchies have been really abolished. I am not so much talking of monarchs retaining a ceremonial role as of growing influence of them.

I can't say Holzhauser has so far been proven wrong yet./HGL

Wednesday, May 23, 2018

Age at death


France St Louis IX to Louis XI : Part I · Part II · Part III · Part IV · Part V
Stats: Age at death · Age at first marriage : a rough estimate

In previous, I made one clear mistake: Charles VI seems to have got by mistake same children as Charles V. Not counted.

I also randomly counted and did not count unknown age of spouse as unknown person of that sex.

Infants and children:

55 of unknown age.

age
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
number
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

age
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
number
26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53

age
00 00 00 00 00 00 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 02 02 02 02 02 02
00 00 00 00 00 00 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 02 02 02 02 02
number
54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79

age
02 02 03 03 03 03 03 04 04 05 06 06 06 06 06 07 07 07 07 07 08 08 08 08 09
02 02 03 03 03 03 03 04 04 05 05 06 06 06 06 07 07 07 07 07 08 08 08 08 09
number
80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02 03 04

age
10 10 10 10 11 12 13 13 13
number
05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13


113 from 0 to 11/13
055 ?
168

Median, less than one year, therefore also lower quartile. Higher quartile, 3 years. Children aged 12 and 13 are boys only, since ladies count as such from age 12.

Ladies:

41 at unknown age (above 11)

age
12 12 12 12 13 13 13 13 15 15 15 16 16 16 16 17 17 17 17 18 18 20 20 20 20
12 12 12 12 13 13 13 13 15 15 15 15 15 16 16 17 17 17 17 17 18 20 20 20 20
number
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

age
21 22 22 22 22 22 22 23 23 23 24 24 25 25 25 25 25 25 26 26 26 27 27 27
21 22 22 22 22 22 22 23 23 23 24 24 25 25 25 25 25 25 26 26 26 26 27 27
number
26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49

age
27 28 28 28 28 28 28 29 29 29 29 29 30 30 31 31 31 32 32 32 33 33 33 33 34 35
number
50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75

age
35 35 36 36 36 36 36 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 38 38 38 39 39 39 39 40 40 41
35 35 35 36 36 36 36 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 38 38 38 39 39 39 39 40 40 41
number
76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01

Cent
01 / 02 = 101 / 102

age
42 42 42 42 43 43 43 43 43 43 44 44 44 44 44 45 45 46 46 47 47 47 47 47 48 48
42 42 42 42 43 43 43 43 43 43 43 44 44 44 44 45 45 46 46 47 47 47 47 47 48 48
number
02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27

age
48 48 48 49 50 50 50 50 51 51 51 52 52 52 53 53 53 53 53 54 54 54 55 55 55
48 48 48 49 49 50 50 50 50 51 51 51 52 52 52 53 53 53 53 54 54 54 55 55 55
number
28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52

age
55 56 56 56 57 57 58 58 58 58 58 59 59 59 59 60 60 60 60 60 60 61 62 62 62 62
number
53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78

age
63 63 63 63 64 65 65 65 66 67 67 67 68 68 69 69 70 70 71 72 72 72 73 73 73 74
number
79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02 03 04

Cent
04 / 05 = 204 / 205

age
76 76 79 78 80 80 85 87 88 89 90
75 76 76 76 78 80 80 87 88 89 90
number
05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15


215 ladies from 12 to 90
041 ?
256

214 / 2 = 107
107 + 1 = 108, median 43 years
106 / 2 = 53
53 + 1 = 54, lower quartile 28 years
107 + 53 + 1 = 161, higher quartile 58 years

Gentlemen:

21 died at unknown age.

age
14 15 15 15 16 17 17 17 17 18 18 19 19 19 19 19 19 19 20 20 20 20 20 21 22
number
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

age
22 23 23 23 23 23 24 24 24 25 25 25 25 26 27 27 27 28 28 28 28 28 29 29 30 30
22 23 23 23 23 23 24 24 24 24 25 25 25 25 27 27 27 28 28 28 28 28 29 29 30 30
number
26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51

age
30 31 31 31 31 31 32 32 32 33 33 33 33 33 33 33 35 35 35 35 35 35 36 36 37
30 31 31 31 31 31 31 32 32 33 33 33 33 33 33 33 35 35 35 35 35 35 36 36 36
number
52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76

age
37 37 37 37 37 37 38 38 38 38 38 38 39 39 39 39 40 40 42 43 43 43 43 43 44 44
number
77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02

Cent
02 / 03 = 102 / 103

age
44 44 44 45 45 45 46 46 46 46 46 46 47 47 48 49 49 49 49 49 49 49 49 50 50
44 44 44 45 45 45 46 46 46 46 46 46 47 47 48 49 49 49 49 49 49 49 49 49 50
number
03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27

age
50 51 51 51 51 51 52 52 52 52 52 52 52 53 53 53 53 54 54 54 54 54 54 54 54 55
50 50 51 51 51 51 52 52 52 52 52 52 52 53 53 53 53 54 54 54 54 54 54 54 54 54
number
28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53

age
55 55 55 55 56 57 57 57 57 57 57 57 57 57 58 58 58 58 59 59 59 59 59 60 60
55 55 55 55 55 56 56 57 57 57 57 57 57 57 57 58 58 58 58 59 59 59 59 59 60
number
54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78

age
61 61 61 61 62 62 62 62 62 62 63 63 64 64 64 64 65 65 66 67 67 67 67 67 67 68
number
79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02 03 04

Cent
04 / 05 = 204 / 205

age
69 70 70 70 71 71 71 71 71 72 73
number
05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15


215 gentlemen from 14 to 73
021 ?
236

Same number, so medians and quartiles are at same number too:

108, median 45 years
54, lower quartile 31 years
161, higher quartile 57 years

Note, this higher quartile for overall siblings coincides well with the median for statistics with "ancestor bias". But, this is for royalties, since commoners lived longer.

Infants and children 168, ladies 256, gentlemen 236 = all together 660. 168 / 660 = 25.45 % infant and child mortality. Only three quarters (somewhat less) reached adulthood./HGL

Friday, May 18, 2018

France St Louis IX to Louis XI, V


France St Louis IX to Louis XI : Part I · Part II · Part III · Part IV · Part V
Stats: Age at death · Age at first marriage : a rough estimate

Excursus
William I, Duke of Bavaria
marriage
He married Matilda of Lancaster, daughter of Henry of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster and Isabel de Beaumont in London in 1352 [she was 13]
child
They had only one daughter, who died in 1356.

Excursus
Albert I, Duke of Bavaria
I marriage
Albert married in Passau after 19 July 1353, Margaret of Brieg from Silesia (1342/43 – 1386), [she was 10/11?]
children
Katherine of Bavaria (c. 1361 – 1400, Hattem), married in Geertruidenberg in 1379 William I of Gelders and Jülich.
Johanna of Bavaria (c. 1362 – 1386), married Wenceslaus, King of the Romans.
Margaret of Bavaria (1363 – 23 January 1423, Dijon), married in Cambrai in 1385 John the Fearless.
William VI, Count of Holland (1365–1417), father of Jacqueline of Hainault.
Albert II, Duke of Bavaria-Straubing (1369 – 21 January 1397, Kelheim).
Joanna Sophia (c. 1373 – 15 November 1410, Vienna), married on 15 June 1395 Albert IV, Duke of Austria.
John, Count of Holland (1374/76 – 1425), Bishop of Liège.
II marriage
Albert contracted a second marriage in 1394 in Heusden with Margaret of Cleves (c. 1375 – 1412), sister of Adolph I, Duke of Cleves, but they had no children.

Excursus
Margaret of Bavaria
marriage
In 1385, at the Burgundian double wedding in Cambrai, she married [at 22] John, Count of Nevers, the son and heir of Philip the Bold, Duke of Burgundy and Margaret of Dampierre, Countess of Flanders, Artois and Burgundy;[3] at the same time her brother, William II, Duke of Bavaria married their daughter Margaret of Burgundy, Duchess of Bavaria.
children
Margaret, Countess of Gien and Montargis (1393–2 February 1441, Paris), married, on 30 August 1404, Louis, Dauphin of France, then, on 10 October 1422, Arthur de Richemont, Constable of France, the future Duke of Brittany
Catherine (d. 1414, Ghent)
Mary (1393 – 30 October 1466). She married Adolph I, Duke of Cleves.
Philip the Good, his successor (1396–1467)
Isabella, Countess of Penthièvre (d. 18 September 1412, Rouvres), married at Arras on 22 July 1406 to Olivier de Châtillon-Blois, Count of Penthièvre and Périgord
Joan (b. 1399, Bouvres), d. young
Anne (1404–14 November 1432, Paris), married John, Duke of Bedford
Agnes (1407–1 December 1476, Château de Moulins), married Charles I, Duke of Bourbon

Excursus
Marie of Burgundy, Duchess of Cleves
marriage
Born in Dijon, she became the second wife of Adolph, Count of Mark in May 1406. [she was 13]
children
Margaret (23 February 1416 – 20 May 1444), married first William III, Duke of Bavaria on 11 May 1433, second Ulrich V, Count of Württemberg on 29 January 1441
Catherine of Cleves (25 May 1417 – 10 February 1479); married on 23 July 1423 Arnold, Duke of Guelders, mother of Mary of Guelders, Queen consort of Scotland
John I, Duke of Cleves (1419–1481); married on 22 April 1455 Elizabeth of Nevers
Elisabeth of Cleves (1420–1488); married on 15 July 1434 Henry XXVI of Schwarzburg-Blankenburg (1418–1488)
Agnes of Cleves (1422–1446); married on 30 September 1439 Charles IV, King of Navarre
Helen of Cleves (1423–1471); married on 12 February 1436 Henry "the Peaceful", Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg (c. 1411–1473)
Adolph of Cleves, Lord of Ravenstein (1425–1492); married on 13 May 1453 Beatrice of Portugal (1435–1462), daughter of Peter, Duke of Coimbra
Marie of Cleves (1426–1487); married on 27 November 1440 Charles, Duke of Orléans. Mother of Louis XII, King of France

Excursus
Margaret of Cleves, Duchess of Bavaria-Munich
I marriage
Sie heiratete am 11. Mai 1433 auf dem Konzil von Basel Wilhelm III. von Bayern-München. [she was 17]
children
Adolph (1434–1441)
William (1435)
II marriage
Nachdem Wilhelm III. 1435 gestorben war, wurde Margarete am 29. Januar 1441 in Stuttgart die erste Ehefrau Ulrichs V. von Württemberg.
daughter
Catharina (1441–1497) - became a Premonstratensian then a Dominican nun in Würzburg, then finally ending up in the monastery under the protection of bishop Rudolf van Würzburg

Excursus
Catherine of Cleves
marriage
Catherine lived with her parents until 1431, despite already having been married the year before. [marriage consumed at 14]
children
Mary (c. 1431-1463), who became Queen of Scotland by marriage to James II
William (born c. 1434), died young
Margaret (c. 1436-1486, Simmern), married on 16 August 1454 to Frederick I, Count of Palatine-Simmern.
Adolf (1438–1477)
Catherine (1439 – 1496), Regent of Guelders in 1477–1481.

Excursus
Mary of Guelders
marriage
Mary married James II, king of Scots, at Holyrood Abbey in Edinburgh on 3 July 1449. [she was 15]
children
An unnamed son. (Both born and died on 19 May 1450).
James III of Scotland (1451–1488).
Mary (May 1453-May 1488), who married first Thomas Boyd, 1st Earl of Arran, and secondly James Hamilton, 1st Lord Hamilton. She became the mother of James Hamilton, 1st Earl of Arran.
Alexander Stewart, Duke of Albany (c. 1454 - 1485).
Margaret (born c. 1455, date of death unknown), who married William Crichton, 3rd Lord Crichton of Auchingoul. She became the mother of Margaret Crichton and mother-in-law of George Leslie, 4th Earl of Rothes.
David Stewart, Earl of Moray (c. 1456 - 1457). He was created Earl of Moray on 12 February 1456.
John Stewart, 1st Earl of Mar and Garioch (c. 1459 - 1479).

Excursus
James III of Scotland
marriage
James married Margaret of Denmark in July 1469 at Holyrood Abbey, Edinburgh. Christian I of Denmark gave the Orkney and Shetland Islands to Scotland in lieu of a dowry. [In July 1469, at the age of 13 she married James III at Holyrood Abbey.]
children
James IV of Scotland (17 March 1473 – 9 September 1513)
James Stewart, Duke of Ross (March 1476 – January 1504)
John Stewart, Earl of Mar (December 1479 – 11 March 1503)

Excursus
James IV of Scotland
marriage
In a ceremony at the altar of Glasgow Cathedral on 10 December 1502, James confirmed the Treaty of Perpetual Peace with Henry VII of England.[31] By this treaty James married Henry's daughter Margaret Tudor. After a wedding by proxy in London, the marriage was confirmed in person on 8 August 1503 at Holyrood Abbey, Edinburgh. [she was 14] Their wedding was commemorated by the gift of a Book of Hours.
children
James, Duke of Rothesay (21 February 1507, Holyrood Palace – 27 February 1508, Stirling Castle)
A stillborn daughter at Holyrood Palace on 15 July 1508
Arthur, Duke of Rothesay (20 October 1509, Holyrood Palace – Edinburgh Castle, 14 July 1510).
James V (Linlithgow Palace, 10 April 1512 – Falkland Palace, Fife, 14 December 1542), the only one to reach adulthood, and the successor of his father.
A second stillborn daughter at Holyrood Palace in November 1512.
Alexander, Duke of Ross (Stirling Castle, 30 April 1514 – Stirling Castle, 18 December 1515), born after James's death.

Excursus
Mary Stewart, Countess of Arran
I marriage
Mary was married to her first husband, Thomas Boyd, Earl of Arran, when she was almost fourteen years old before 26 April 1467.
children
Lady Margaret Boyd (1468–1533[4]), married firstly, Alexander Forbes, 4th Lord Forbes; secondly Sir David Kennedy, 1st Earl of Cassilis
James Boyd, 2nd Lord Boyd of Kilmarnock (1469–1484), died unmarried.
II marriage
In early 1474, Mary married secondly as her second husband, James Hamilton, 1st Lord Hamilton, who was almost forty years her senior. They received a papal dispensation on 26 April 1476 thus legitimising the two children already born to them.
children
James Hamilton, 1st Earl of Arran (1475–1529), married firstly in 1490 Elizabeth Home by whom he had two daughters; he divorced Elizabeth in 1504. He married secondly in 1516, Janet Bethune, daughter of Sir David Bethune, 1st of Creich and Janet Duddlingston,[5] by whom he had three children including his heir, James Hamilton, Duke of Châtellerault, 2nd Earl of Arran (c.1516- 22 January 1575), heir presumptive to the Kingdom of Scotland (2 July 1536 – 22 May 1540), (April 1541- 8 December 1542), (14 December 1542 – 19 June 1566), and (29 July 1567 – 22 January 1575); Regent of Scotland (1542–1554).
Hon. Elizabeth Hamilton (died after April 1531), married on 9 April 1494, Matthew Stewart, 2nd Earl of Lennox, by whom she had issue. The Stewarts of Lennox, of whom Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley, the second husband of Mary, Queen of Scots, was the most notable, who derived his claim to the Scottish throne from Elizabeth's son John Stewart, 3rd Earl of Lennox.
Robert Hamilton, Seigneur d'Aubigny (21 March 1476 - 1543). He was born at Brodick Castle, Isle of Arran, Scotland. He died in 1543 in Torrence, Lanarkshire, Scotland, when he was 66 years old. According to some records, he married (Elizabeth?) Campbell, the daughter of Campbell (Goodman) of Glaister, or Glacester (Angus), the niece of the Sheriff of Ayr [the latter of whom also had connection to the earls of Lennox]. They had at least two (claimed) children: Janet Hamilton, born in 1500, who wed Alexander Burnet, 4th Baron & 9th Laird of Leys; and Matthew Hamilton, born in 1512, who wed Jean Muirhead of Torrence.

Excursus
James Hamilton, 1st Earl of Arran
I marriage
James Hamilton was married firstly, around 1490, to Elizabeth Home, daughter of Alexander Home, 2nd Lord Home by his second wife, Nichola Ker. The marriage was dissolved in 1506, when it was found that her first husband Thomas Hay, a son of John Hay, 1st Lord Hay of Yester, was still alive at the time of the wedding.
II marriage
Hamilton was married secondly, in November 1516, to Janet Bethune, daughter of Sir David Bethune of Creich,[5] and widow of Sir Robert Livingstone of Easter Wemyss, who had been killed at the Battle of Flodden.
children
Lady Helen Hamilton, who married Archibald Campbell, 4th Earl of Argyll
James Hamilton, 2nd Earl of Arran (c. 1516 – 22 January 1575), who later became Duke of Châtelherault and governor of Scotland, during the minority of Mary, Queen of Scots.
Lady Janet Hamilton, who married Alexander Cunningham, 5th Earl of Glencairn.
A son, name unknown.

Excursus
Margaret of Guelders
marriage
In Lobith on 6 August 1454 she married Frederick I, Count Palatine of Simmern [when she was 18]
children
Katherine (1455 – 28 December 1522)
Stephen (25 February 1457 – 1488/9)
William (2 January 1458 – 1458)
John I (15 May 1459 – 27 January 1509)
Frederick (10 April 1460 – 22 November 1518)
Rupert (16 October 1461 – 19 April 1507). From 1492 until his death he was the forty-fifth bishop of Regensburg as Rupert II.
Anne (30 July 1465 – 15 July 1517)
Margaret (2 December 1466 – August 1506)
Helene (1467 – 21 February 1555)
William (20 April 1468 – 1481)

Excursus
John I, Count Palatine of Simmern
marriage
He married Joanna of Nassau-Saarbrücken the daughter of Johann II of Nassau-Saarbrücken on 29 September 1481 [when she was 17]
children
Friedrich (*/† 1490)
Johann II. (1492–1557), Pfalzgraf von Simmern
Friedrich (1494–?), Dompropst in Straßburg

Excursus
Adolf, Duke of Guelders
marriage
Adolf married Catharine of Bourbon (1440–1469), daughter of Charles I, Duke of Bourbon, in 1463. [when she was 23]
twin children
Philippa (1467–1547), married in 1485 René II, Duke of Lorraine (1451–1508)
Charles (1467–1538), later Duke of Guelders, married in 1518 with Elisabeth of Brunswick-Lüneburg (1494–1572), daughter of Henry I of Lüneburg.

Excursus
Philippa of Guelders, Duchess of Lorraine
marriage
To strengthen the ties between the Kingdom of France and the Duchy of Lorraine, she was chosen as the bride of René II, Duke of Lorraine (1451–1508). The marriage took place in Orléans on 1 September 1485. [when she was 18]
children
Charles (b. 17 August 1486, Nancy), d. young
Francis (5 July 1487, Pont-à-Mousson) (died shortly after birth)
Antoine, Duke of Lorraine (1489–1544)
Anne (19 December 1490, Bar-le-Duc – 1491)
Nicholas (9 April 1493, Nancy), d. young
Isabelle (2 November 1494, Lunéville – bef. 1508)
Claude, Duke of Guise (1496–1550), first Duke of Guise
John, Cardinal of Lorraine and Bishop of Metz (1498–1550)
Louis, Count of Vaudémont (1500–1528)
Claude and Catherine (twins) (24 November 1502, Bar-le-Duc), ...
... d. young
Francis, Count of Lambesc (1506–1525)

Excursus
John I, Duke of Cleves
marriage
On 22 April 1455 he married Elizabeth Countess of Nevers, daughter of John II, Count of Nevers. [she was 15/16]
children
John II, Duke of Cleves (13 April 1458 – 15 March 1521) married 3 November 1489 Matilda of Hesse
Adolf (1461–1525)
Engelbert, Count of Nevers (26 September 1462 – 21 November 1506) married 23 February 1489 Charlotte de Bourbon-Vendôme
Dietrich (1464)
Marie of Cleves (1465–1513)
Philip of Cleves, Bishop of Nevers, Amiens and Autun (1467–1505)

Excursus
John II, Duke of Cleves
curiosity:
He was called "The Babymaker" since he fathered sixty-three illegitimate children [1] before his marriage with Mathilde of Hesse in 1490.
marriage
Am 3. November 1489 heiratete er Mechthild von Hessen (* 1. Juli 1473; † 19. Februar 1505), Tochter des Landgrafen Heinrich III. von Hessen. [she was 16]
children
John III (1490–1539), his successor
Anna (1495–1567), married in 1518 with count Philip III of Waldeck-Eisenberg
Adolf (1498–1525), appointed by his father's cousin Philip of Cleves, Lord of Ravenstein and Wijnendale, as his successor, but died before Philip (1528)

Excursus
Engelbert von Kleve
marriage
Engelbert heiratete am 23. Februar 1489 auf königlichen Wunsch Charlotte de Bourbon, eine Tochter des Grafen von Vendôme, Jean VIII. de Bourbon. Nach dem Tod Engelberts trat sie in die Abtei von Fontevrault ein, wo sie am 14. Dezember 1520 starb.
children
1
2
3
4 died young
Charles II, Count of Nevers, married Marie of Albret, Countess of Rethel. (died in Louvre in 1521)
Louis († 1545), genannt Graf von Auxerre
François († 1545), Prior von Saint-Éloi in Paris

Excursus
Henry the Peaceful, Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg
marriage
Henry married Helen (1423–1471), daughter of Adolph I, Duke of Cleves, in 1436. [when she was 13]
child
Margaret (1450–1509), married William III, Count of Henneberg

Excursus
Adolph of Cleves, Lord of Ravenstein
marriage
Philip the Good of Burgundy and his wife, Isabel of Portugal, decided to arrange the marriage of their nephew Adolph, who became engaged to infanta Beatrice of Coimbra, daughter of Pedro, Duke of Coimbra. Beatrice had taken refuge in Burgundy, under her aunt’s protection, following the defeat of her father's army in the Battle of Alfarrobeira in Portugal in 1449. Adolph and Beatrice were married on 13 May 1453 [when she was 18]
children
Philip of Cleves (1456-1528)
Louise (1457-1458)

Excursus
Marie of Cleves, Duchess of Orléans
(I) marriage
At age fourteen, Marie married Charles of Valois, Duke of Orléans, a man 32 years her senior,[1] on 27 November 1440 in Saint-Omer.
children
Marie of Orléans (19 December 1457 – 1493); married John of Foix, Count of Étampes in 1476 [see above]
Louis XII of France (1462–1515)
Anne of Orléans (1464–1491); became the Abbess of Fontevrault and Poitiers.

Excursus
Philip the Good
I marriage
On 28 January 1405, Philip was named Count of Charolais in appanage of the duke and probably became engaged on the same day, at the age of 8, to Michelle of Valois [who was 14, while he was 12], a daughter of King Charles VI of France and Isabeau of Bavaria. They were married in June 1409.
child
Michelle had borne a daughter, Agnes, but she died in infancy.
II marriage
After Michelle's death in 1422, Philip married Bonne of Artois,[3] a daughter of Philip of Artois, Count of Eu, and also the widow of his uncle, Philip II, Count of Nevers, in Moulins-les-Engelbert on 30 November 1424. Bonne of Artois is sometimes confused with Philip's biological aunt, also named Bonne (a sister of John the Fearless who lived from 1379 to 1399), in part due to the papal dispensation required for the marriage, which made no distinction between a marital aunt and a biological aunt. Bonne of Artois lived only a year after Philip married her.
III marriage
Philip was married for a third time to Isabella of Portugal, a daughter of John I of Portugal and Philippa of Lancaster, in Bruges on 7 January 1430. [she was 33]
children
Anthony (September 30, 1430, Brussels – February 5, 1432, Brussels), Count of Charolais
Josse (April 24, 1432 – aft. May 6, 1432), Count of Charolais
Charles (10 November 1433 – 5 January 1477), Count of Charolais and Philip's successor as Duke of Burgundy, known as "Charles the Bold" or "Charles the Rash"

Excursus
Charles the Bold
I marriage
On 19 May 1440, he married Catherine of France (1428–1446), daughter of Charles VII of France and Marie of Anjou.[10] At the time of the marriage, she was 12 and he 6. She died at 18. [Bride Stories, anyone?]
II marriage
On 30 October 1454, he married Isabelle of Bourbon (1437–1465) [who was 17], daughter of Charles I of Bourbon.[10] He would have preferred to marry Anne of York (the daughter of Richard, Duke of York), but his father insisted that he fulfill the conditions of the Treaty of Arras, which committed him to marry a French princess. The marriage was a happy one ...
child
Mary of Burgundy (13 February 1457 – 27 March 1482)
III marriage
On 3 July 1468, Charles married Anne's sister, Margaret of York (1446–1503);[10] her siblings also included Edward IV of England, George, Duke of Clarence, and Richard III of England. The marriage was solemnized at Damme, near Bruges, by the bishop of Salisbury.

Excursus
Mary of Burgundy
marriage
Mary soon made her choice among the many suitors for her hand by selecting Archduke Maximilian of Austria, the future Holy Roman Emperor Maximilian I, who became her co-ruler.[4] The marriage took place at Ghent on the evening of 16 August 1477.[5] [when she was 20]
children
Philip the Handsome (22 July 1478 – 25 September 1506), who succeeded his mother as Philip IV of Burgundy and became Philip I of Castile through his marriage to Joanna of Castile (known to history as "Juana la Loca")
Margaret (10 January 1480 – 1 December 1530), married to first to Juan, Prince of Asturias, the son and heir of King Ferdinand II of Aragon and Queen Isabella I of Castile, and secondly to Philibert II, Duke of Savoy.
Francis (2 September 1481 – 26 December 1481).
birth and death
Her birth, according to the court chronicler Georges Chastellain, was attended by a clap of thunder ringing from the otherwise clear twilight sky. Her godfather was Louis, Dauphin of France, in exile in Burgundy at that time; he named her for his mother Marie of Anjou. Reactions to the child were mixed: the baby's grandfather, Duke Philip the Good, was unimpressed, and "chose not to attend the [baptism] as it was only for a girl", whereas her grandmother Isabella of Portugal was delighted at the birth of a granddaughter.[2] Her illegitimate aunt Anne was assigned as her governess. ... In 1482, a falcon hunt in the woods near Wijnendale Castle was organised by Adolph of Cleves, Lord of Ravenstein, who lived in the castle. Mary loved riding and was hunting with Maximilian and knights of the Court when her horse tripped, threw her in a ditch, and then landed on top of her, breaking her back. She died several weeks later, on 27 March, from internal injuries, having made a detailed will. She was buried in the Church of Our Lady in Bruges on April 3rd, 1482.[6] Her 2-year-old daughter, Margaret of Austria, was sent in vain to France, to marry the Dauphin, in an attempt to please Louis XI not to invade the territories owned by Mary of Burgundy.

Excursus
Philip I of Castile
marriage
On 20 October 1496, he married Joanna (6 November 1479 – 12 April 1555), daughter of King Ferdinand II of Aragon and Queen Isabella I of Castile, in Lier, Belgium. [she was 16, going on 17]
children
Eleanor (1498–1558), queen consort of Portugal and France
Charles V (1500–1558), king of Spain, emperor of the Holy Roman Empire
Isabella (1501–1526), queen consort of Denmark, Norway and Sweden
Ferdinand I (1503–1564), king of Bohemia and Hungary, emperor of the Holy Roman Empire
Mary (1505–1558), queen consort of Hungary and Bohemia, governor of the Spanish Netherlands
Catherine (1507–1578), queen consort of Portugal

Excursus
Margaret of Austria, Duchess of Savoy
I real marriage
In order to achieve an alliance with Queen Isabella I of Castile and King Ferdinand II of Aragon, Maximilian started negotiating the marriage of their only son and heir, John, Prince of Asturias, to Margaret, as well as the marriage of their daughter, Juana, to Philip. Margaret left the Netherlands for Spain late in 1496. The marriage took place in 1497. [when she was 17]
child
Margaret was left pregnant, but on 2 April 1498 she gave birth to a premature stillborn daughter.
II marriage
In 1501, Margaret married Philibert II, Duke of Savoy (1480–1504).
widowhood
This marriage was childless as well, and he died after three years. A grief-stricken Margaret threw herself out of a window, but was saved. After being persuaded to bury her husband, she had his heart embalmed so she could keep it with her forever.[3] She vowed never to marry again. Her court historian and poet Jean Lemaire de Belges gave her the title "Dame de deuil" (Lady of Mourning).[4]
death
In November 1530, one of Margaret's maids broke a glass goblet. A splinter of glass went into Margaret's foot and the wound became gangrenous. Her doctors strongly recommended that she agree to having her foot amputated. She gave her consent for the operation, received the sacrament, and revised her will. Before the amputation could be performed, however, she died, apparently from an overdose of opium given to her in preparation for the operation. She died at Mechelen at the age of fifty, after appointing her nephew, Charles V, as her universal and sole heir. She is buried at Bourg-en-Bresse, in the magnificent mausoleum that she ordered for her second husband and herself.

Excursus
Anne of Burgundy
childless marriage

Excursus
Agnes of Burgundy, Duchess of Bourbon
marriage
Elle épousa à Autun le 17 septembre 1425 Charles Ier, duc de Bourbon et d'Auvergne [she was 18]
children
John of Bourbon (1426–1488), Duke of Bourbon
Mary of Bourbon (1428–1448), married in 1444 John II, Duke of Lorraine
Philip of Bourbon (1430–1440), Lord of Beaujeu
Charles of Bourbon (Château de Moulins 1434–1488, Lyon), Cardinal and Archbishop of Lyon and Duke of Bourbon
Isabella of Bourbon (1436–1465), married Charles, Duke of Burgundy. Isabella was mother of Mary of Burgundy.
Peter of Bourbon, (1438–1503, Château de Moulins), Duke of Bourbon
Louis of Bourbon (1438 – 30 August 1482, murdered), Bishop of Liège
Margaret of Bourbon (5 February 1439 – 1483, Château du Pont-Ains), married in Moulins on 6 April 1472 Philip II, Duke of Savoy
Catharine of Bourbon (Liège, 1440 – 21 May 1469, Nijmegen), married on 28 December 1463 in Bruges Adolf II, Duke of Guelders
Joanna of Bourbon (1442–1493, Brussels), married in Brussels in 1467 John II of Chalon, Prince of Orange
Jacques of Bourbon (1445–1468, Bruges), Count of Montpensier. Unmarried

[I get a feeling of déjà vu, and I think I will have no more excursus, only the kings. Otherwise I might risk too much counting same couples twice.]

Louis X of France
first marriage
On 21 September 1305, at age 16, he married Margaret of Burgundy and they had a daughter, Joan.
second marriage
Margaret of Burgundy died on 14 August 1315 and Louis remarried five days later, on 19 August to Clementia of Hungary, the daughter of Charles Martel of Anjou and the niece of Louis' own uncle and close advisor, Charles of Valois. Louis and Clementia were crowned at Reims in August 1315.
children:
Joan II of Navarre (French: Jeanne; 28 January 1312[1] – 6 October 1349)
John I of France John I (15–20 November 1316), called the Posthumous, was King of France and Navarre, as the posthumous son and successor of Louis X, for the five days he lived in 1316.

King Philip VI
first marriage
In July 1313, Philip married Joan the Lame (French: Jeanne), daughter of Robert II, Duke of Burgundy,[20] and Agnes of France, the youngest daughter of Louis IX. In an ironic twist to his "male" ascendancy to the throne, the intelligent, strong-willed Joan, an able regent of France during the king's long military campaigns, was said to be the brains behind the throne and the real ruler of France.
children
John II (26 April 1319 – 8 April 1364).
Marie (1326 – 22 September 1333), who married John of Brabant, the son and heir of John III, Duke of Brabant, but died shortly afterwards.
Louis (born and died 17 January 1329)
Louis (8 June 1330 – 23 June 1330).
son [John?] (born and died 2 October 1333).
A son (28 May 1335), stillborn.
Philip (1 July 1336 – 1 September 1375), Duke of Orléans
Joan (born and died November 1337).
A son (born and died summer 1343).
second marriage
After Joan died in 1349, Philip married Blanche of Navarre,[22] daughter of Joan II and Philip III of Navarre, on 11 January 1350.
daughter
Joan (Blanche) (May 1351 – 16 September 1371),[21] who was intended to marry John I of Aragon, but who died during the journey.
Charles V
Joanna (September 1357 – 21 October 1360), interred at Saint-Antoine-des-Champs Abbey.
Bonne (1358 – 7 December 1360, Paris, France), interred beside her older sister.
John (Vincennes, 6 June 1366 – 21 December 1366), interred at Saint Denis Basilica.
Charles VI (3 December 1368 – 22 October 1422), King of France.
Marie (Paris, 27 February 1370 – June 1377, Paris).
Louis (13 March 1372 – 23 November 1407), Duke of Orléans.
Isabella (Paris, 24 July 1373 – 13 February 1377, Paris).
John (1374/76 – died young).
Catherine (Paris, 4 February 1378 – November 1388, buried at Abbaye De Maubuisson, France), m. John of Berry, Count of Montpensier (son of John, Duke of Berry).

Charles VI
Joanna (September 1357 – 21 October 1360), interred at Saint-Antoine-des-Champs Abbey.
Bonne (1358 – 7 December 1360, Paris, France), interred beside her older sister.
John (Vincennes, 6 June 1366 – 21 December 1366), interred at Saint Denis Basilica.
Charles VI (3 December 1368 – 22 October 1422), King of France.
Marie (Paris, 27 February 1370 – June 1377, Paris).
Louis (13 March 1372 – 23 November 1407), Duke of Orléans.
Isabella (Paris, 24 July 1373 – 13 February 1377, Paris).
John (1374/76 – died young).
Catherine (Paris, 4 February 1378 – November 1388, buried at Abbaye De Maubuisson, France), m. John of Berry, Count of Montpensier (son of John, Duke of Berry).

King Charles VII
marriage
The wedding took place in April 1422 at Bourges. The wedding made her Queen of France, but as far as it is known, Marie of Anjou was never crowned.
children
Louis XI (3 July 1423 – 30 August 1483)
John 19 September 1426 Lived for a few hours.
Radegonde after 29 August 1428 19 March 1444 Betrothed to Sigismund, Archduke of Austria on 22 July 1430.
Catherine after 29 August 1428 13 July 1446 Married Charles the Bold, no issue.
James 1432 2 March 1437 Died aged five.
Yolande 23 September 1434 23/29 August 1478 Married Amadeus IX, Duke of Savoy, had issue.
Joan 4 May 1435 4 May 1482 Married John II, Duke of Bourbon, no issue.
Philip 4 February 1436 11 June 1436 Died in infancy.
Margaret May 1437 24 July 1438 Died aged one.
Joanna 7 September 1438 26 December 1446 Twin of Marie, died aged eight.
Marie 7 September 1438 14 February 1439 Twin of Joanna, died in infancy.
Isabella 1441 Died young.
Magdalena 1 December 1443 21 January 1495 Married Gaston of Foix, Prince of Viana, had issue.
Charles 12 December 1446 24 May 1472 Died without legitimate issue.


Here, I take a break, feeling, my accumulated material on 5 posts is enough for some statistic significance.

Sources, diverse wikipedian articles, starting with that on St. Louis IX:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_IX_of_France

Next time - the statistics, or some of them./HGL

Does my Interpretation of Mahabharata and Ramayana Offend Hindoos?


Perhaps it should - unless it shakes them up to check out how it fits the facts.

My interpretation of these epics is no more a Hindoo one, than the Hindoo interpretation of the Gospels (Hindoos often have one, especially in the West) is a Christian one.

Any religion claiming to be the true one, and the one which is so, must be one of the ones claiming it, must have at least in principle a fairly complete answer to the other religions, the false ones.

If Hinduism claims to be true, it needs, especially in the West, an interpretation of the Gospels, and how we Christians "misunderstood" Our Lord Jesus Christ.

If Christianity claims to be true, it needs, since at least 16th Century Portuguese contacts, or even earlier, the Thomas Christians, some kind of attitude about the story of Ramayana and Mahabharata.

Mine is, the early predecessors of Hindooism after the Flood clang to the memory of Rama (in Douay-Reims called Regma), turned young Nimrod (his brother, who started out as a good and protective brother, before he went bad) into Hanuman (he had perhaps a close relation with monkeys - some explain his "beginning to be a giant" with inoculation with monkey genes, but that could be after his protection of Rama, or the most catastrophic results, at Babel / Göbekli Tepe could have come after that), and put the memory of a pre-Flood set of heros, among which another Cush than the one so called in the Bible, I presume Jubal, the flute player, into the Mahabharata and Puranas. And counted years (of what is now known as "kali yuga") from his death, before the Flood. THEN pushing back the tale of Rama to well before him, so India could seem a continuity from Rama's post-Flood settlement "into" what was actually a memory of Nod, East of Eden.

If this offends a Hindoo, let him consider, I am not pretending to be a Mahabharata or Ramayana or Puranas scholar, I am simply giving a Christian view on why Hindoos believe what they traditionally believe. Obviously, this involves Hinduism being wrong, just as my interpretation of Mohammed involves Islam being wrong, or of Joseph Smith Mormonism being wrong. A religion is an exclusive thing, if one is right, the others are wrong. Since I am a Catholic, I believe other interpretations of Christianity, and non-Christian religions, are wrong. If that offends all Hindoos in the world, I will still not change it.

I said sth about fitting the facts. Mahabharata seems to involve trace memories - not a full accurate, but partial accurate descriptions - of nuclear warfare. Put this in archaeological contexts like the timespan of carbon dating I consider post-Flood, it won't fit very well. Put it pre-Flood, and the worst scenes could have been covered by mud in the Flood, which afterwards became the Himalayas. God's Taj Mahal over so many men suffering so much evil, so much heroism leading to so little good.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Paris Beaubourg
Second Friday of
Pentecost Novena
St Venantius, Martyr
18.V.2018

Wednesday, May 16, 2018

I was excited to find Jesse Collings as Honorary Freeman of the City of Birmingham


So, "Birmingham" ... was Tolkien one?

Honorary Freedom of the City of Birmingham
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honorary_Freedom_of_the_City_of_Birmingham


Individually, by name, no.

During his lifetime, no.

But so to speak, posthumously, in his regiment, yes.

Royal Regiment of Fusiliers 7 May 1975


OK, he was dead, but was it his old regiment?

Royal Regiment of Fusiliers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Regiment_of_Fusiliers


The Royal Regiment of Fusiliers was formed on 23 April 1968 as part of the reforms of the British Army that saw the creation of 'large infantry regiments', by the amalgamation of the four English Fusilier regiments:[1]

  • Royal Northumberland Fusiliers
  • Royal Warwickshire Fusiliers
  • Royal Fusiliers (City of London Regiment)
  • Lancashire Fusiliers


Now, is any of the four his old regiment? Yes.

J. R. R. Tolkien
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._R._R._Tolkien


Military career
Allegiance United Kingdom
Service/branch British Army
Years of service 1915–1920
Rank Lieutenant
Unit Lancashire Fusiliers
Battles/wars First World War

  • Battle of the Somme


So, in a sense, Tolkien was at last given this magnificent Medieval Title : Freeman of the City of Birmingham. Chesterton lacked the local attachment, but a man he admired, like Tolkien admired him, Jesse Collings, had it and it was fitting he should have some shade of it too:

The Freedom of the City is an honour bestowed by a municipality upon a valued member of the community, or upon a visiting celebrity or dignitary. Arising from the medieval practice of granting respected citizens freedom from serfdom, the tradition still lives on in countries such as the United Kingdom, Ireland, Australia, Canada, South Africa and New Zealand – although today the title of "freeman" confers no special privileges. The Freedom of the City can also be granted by municipal authorities to military units which have earned the city's trust; in this context, it is sometimes called the Freedom of Entry. This allows them the freedom to parade through the city, and is an affirmation of the bond between the regiment and the citizenry.


Incidentally, this seems to correct one problematic passage I made earlier on, of him riding into battle:

1916 is when Tolkien married. And next year, he rode into WW-I, perhaps on a white horse. Unless its colours were more like those of Shadowfaxe.


Hmmm .... Fusiliers are (blushing) Infantry ... sorry./HGL

Saturday, May 12, 2018

Hans, Alexander, Sophie, Willy, Kurt ... une Rose Blanche


Je viens de noter, procurez-le vous, dans le dernier Historia (Mai 2018), Rose Blanche contre Croix Gammée. Le dossier entier, sur p. 54, est intitulé "seuls, ils ont osé défier Hitler", ce qui est faux et ne rend pas compte de par exemple l'évêque Clemens August Graf von Galen, évêque ou archévêque de Munster.

Leur résistance contre la guerre et les atrocités contre les Juifs a inspiré ma propre activité en opposition contre l'avortement et la psychiatrie, l'école obligatoire et les enlèvements d'enfants, et contre les contraceptifs.

Je viens de lire leur roman, quasiment - les mémoires de Sophie Scholl, il me semble - à Sysslebäck (un lieu-dit où j'avais été professeur, se prononce comme deux oiseaux qui se "sucent les becs"). J'ai peu, mais quelque quand même, appris de nouveau en lisant l'article.

Sur la BBC, à l'été 1943, Thomas Mann salue le sacrifice de ces "courageux, magnifiques jeunes gens", alors que la RAF largue des milliers d'exemplaires de leur dernier tract au-dessus des villes allemandes.


J'imagine très bien Christopher Tolkien en service en cette opération - noble, mais peut-être contreproductive. Je ne sais pas. Quand un tract est lâché par des gens qui plus tard lâchent des bombes sur Dresde, bon, ce n'est pas totalement un compliment pour le patriotisme de l'auteur - et la Rose Blanche était pourtant très patriote./HGL

Friday, May 11, 2018

On m'a demandé pourquoi je suis converti au catholicisme


Simplement, c'est l'Église que Jésus-Christ, Notre Sauveur et Seigneur, fonda.

Plus en détail : ce n'est pas recevable de dire que celle-ci ne serait pas accessible et identifiable. Il a dit : une ville fondée sur une montagne ne peut pas être caché. Encore, l'Église qu'Il fonda est "pilier et fondement de la vérité" donc comparable à une lampe. Mais nul ne va allumer une lampe pour la mettre sous le boisseau. Et encore, Il l'a promis directement, disant aux 11 Apôtres qu'Il sera avec eux tous les jours (pas juste toujours, mais, tous les jours) et que des signes les suivront.

Encore plus en détail : donc, ce ne peut pas être une église issue de la Réforme. Celles-ci prétendent normalement, soit sue la vraie église aurait sombré et devait être purifié des siècles après d'avoir sombré, soit qu'elle ait cessé d'exister et soit revenue à l'existence grâce à la Réforme. Cette dernière version est davantage logique mais aussi plus directement contre les Promesses, je ne sais pas s'il y a qui le prétendent à part la mouvance restaurationniste (dont Church of God ou T de J). Et encore améliore leur théologie, mais empirent leur histoire en prétendant que la vraie église aurait toujours existé à côté de l'Église catholique, sous divers noms.

En Suède, l'Église dite "apostolique" (non issue de la réforme, mais prétendant être en continuité directe avec la première église, donc identique) était au moins la Moyen Âge classique comme tardif l'Église catholique. Certains voudraient prétendre qu'il y ait eu des "orthodoxes" (mais avant le schisme de 1053, donc tout aussi catholiques, selon l'ecclésiologie catholique) en Suède pendant le Haut Moyen Âge, les siècles considérés comme païens ... mon choix entre Catholiques et Orthodoxes a pu être superficiel, celui contre le Luthéranisme ne l'était pas. (Après, j'ai essayé les Orthodoxes, et je suis revenu).

À part l'impossibilité théologique d'une réforme comme envisagé par les frères Petri et Gustave Wasa, elle a été violente et révolutionnaire. On avait des lycées au Moyen Âge, les lycées protestants datent de la reine Christina, arrière-petit-fille du roi Réformateur./HGL

Thursday, May 3, 2018

De tribus impostoribus


Georges Minois a écrit un livre dans lequel il dit, que Frédérick II le Stauffer n'ait nullement écrit ce livre. On l'aurait inventé de lui, pour démoniser le pouvoir impérial du Saint Empire Romain de Nation Germanique dans la lutte entre celui-ci et le pouvoir papal. Pourtant, ce livre décrié a fini par exister, sous les Lumières.

Qui crie "gare au loup" ...

Amazon : Le Traité des trois imposteurs : Histoire d'un livre blasphématoire qui n'existait pas
Broché – 7 janvier 2009
de Georges Minois (Auteur)
https://www.amazon.fr/Trait%C3%A9-trois-imposteurs-blasph%C3%A9matoire-nexistait/dp/2226183124