Friday, January 27, 2017

Where my dating of music differs from Habermehl's


Here is a table from Habermehl's essay or paper :

Instrument(s)
Standard Date
(presumed as C14)
 Biblical Date
(according to A. Habermehl)
 
Divje Babe bone flute (Turk & Dimkaroski 2011)
50,000 BP 2500 BC
 
Hohle Fels bone flute (Conard et al. 2009)
35,000 BP ≈2400 BC
 
Chinese flute set (Zhang et al. 1999)
7,000–5,000 BC 2300–2100 BC
 
Antaras of Peru (Bishop 2014)
≈4200 BC ≈2100 BC
 
Harp rock etching from Megiddo (Braun 2002)
≈3300–3000 BC 2000 BC
 
Lithophone of Vietnam (Lithophone 2008)
3000 BC 1900 BC
 
Sumerian musicians bas relief (Wilson 2012)
3000 BC 1900 BC
 
Boat lyre of Ur (de Schauensee 2002)
2500 BC 1600 BC
 
Megiddo ivory plaque lyre (Bromiley 1986)
1150 BC 650 BC
 
Harps bas relief from Nimrud (British Museum)
870 BC 625 BC
 
Hittite musicians sculpture (Ceram 1973)
750 BC 600 BC
 
Table: A. Habermehl 2015, transscr. HGL 2017
source:
Dating Prehistoric Musical Instruments: The Two Timelines
Anne Habermehl
http://www.creationsixdays.net/dating_prehistoric_musical_instr.htm


So, I know from the paper also that she goes about using all of evolutionist dating - C14 or otherwise - as one timeline, to be compressed according to the Biblical one, so she places Flood at "beginning of Huronian Ice Age" because all the ice ages were only one (doesn't mean their timeline has to be compressed into one) and "it" = "all of them" = "the first of them" began at the Flood.

While ice age may well have begun at the Flood, the dating of Huronian ice age has nothing to do with carbon dating and should not be involved in compressing the time line of carbon dates. Now, archaeology has mostly only carbon dating and dendrochronology, sometimes comparisons of style with artefacts that elsewhere have been carbon dated. So, all the time line of the musical instruments is very apt for a compression of a purely carbon date related timeline, like the compression I did here:

New blog on the kid : Avec un peu d'aide de Fibonacci ... j'ai une table, presque correcte
http://nov9blogg9.blogspot.com/2015/10/avec-un-peu-daide-de-fibonacci-jai-une.html


2957 BC
or, year of the Flood
acc. to Roman Martyrology
 
3.90625 % + 26 800 years
29 757 BC (20 000 ?? – 50 000 ?)
 
2778 BC
40.23593 % + 7550 years
10 328 BC
 
2599 BC
62.75068 % + 3850 years
6449 BC
 
2420 BC
76.66562 % + 2200 years
4620 BC
 
2241 BC
86.26541 % + 1200 years
3441 BC
 
2062 BC
91.58056 % + 730 years
2792 BC
 
1883 BC
94.86521 % + 440 years
2323 BC
 
1704 BC
96.89571 % + 260 years
1964 BC
 
1525 BC
98.14985 % + 150 years
1675 BC
 
1346 BC
98.92632 % + 90 years
1436 BC
 
1167 BC
99.40408 % + 50 years
1217 BC
 
988 BC
99.70269 % + 30 years
1018 BC
 
809 BC
99.88185 % + 10 years
819 BC
 
630 BC
100.00129 % 0 years ±.
630 BC


Since a few days ago, I consider that dates from 20,000 BC are clearly post-Flood. 22000 BP = 6.986 % remaining.

6.986 % remaining, divided by the 54.788 % of decay mean the original, if from that year, would have been 12.75 %, which is a high contrast to a mean of 3.9 % and minima reaching below. Even if post-Flood levels soon rose from 3.9 % past these 12.75 %, to 40 % in only 179 years.

Instrument(s)
Standard Date (presumed as C14) Biblical Date (Fibonacci table for C-14 conversion)
 
Divje Babe bone flute
50,000 BP pre-Flood or close to Flood 2957 BC
 
Hohle Fels bone flute
35,000 BP pre-Flood or close to Flood 2957 BC
 
For above, pre-Flood values are possible, and for Divjo Babe bone flute at least rather probable.
 
Chinese flute set
7,000–5,000 BC (C14?)  2778 - 2599 - 2420 BC
 
Antaras of Peru (Bishop 2014)
≈4200 BC 2420 - 2241 BC
 
Harp rock etching from Megiddo
≈3300–3000 BC 2241 - 2062 BC
 
Lithophone of Vietnam
3000 BC 2241 - 2062 BC
 
Sumerian musicians bas relief
3000 BC 2241 - 2062 BC
 
Boat lyre of Ur
2500 BC 2062 - 1883 BC
 
Megiddo ivory plaque lyre
1150 BC 1167 - 988 BC
 
Harps bas relief from Nimrud
870 BC 988 - 809 BC
 
Hittite musicians sculpture
750 BC 809 - 630 BC
 
Table: H. G. Lundahl 2017


I have here not dared to be more precise than giving a Biblical date between two years.

How would I go about 7000 - 5000 BC for a more precise date?

2778 40.23593 %
2599 62.75068 %
5377 C2.98661 %
2688 51.4933 %
51.4933 % * 56.6 % = 29.1452078 %
29.1452078 % = 10200 BP = 8200 BC

2688 051.4933 %
2599 062.75068 %
5287 114.24398 %
2643 057.12199 %
57.12199 % * 56.909 % = 32.5075532891 %
32.5075532891 % = 9300 BP = 7300 BC

2643 057.12199 %
2599 062.75068 %
5242 119.87267 %
2621 059.93633 %
59.93633 % * 57.061 % = 34.2002692613 %
34.2002692613 % = 8850 BP = 6833 BC

2643 057.12199 %
2621 059.93633 %
5264 117.05832 %
2632 058.02916 % * 56.985 %
= 33.067916826 % = 9150 BP = 7133 BC

Close enough to 7000 BC.

And for the other date, 5000 BC?

2599 062.75068 %
2420 076.66562 %
5019 139.4163 %
2509 069.70815 % * 57.839 %
= 40.3184968785 % = 7500 BP = 5500 BC

2509 069.70815 %
2420 076.66562 %
4929 146.37377 %
2464 073.186885 % * 58.155 %
= 42.56183297175 % = 7050 BP = 5013 BC

Close enough too.

A caveat, I skipped the part in which 2017-1950 = 67 years are deduced from the resulting dates to get a conventional BP, and instead deduced the 2017 (or at worst 2000) from the BP date instead of deducing 1950, to get the BC date.

Another caveat. The table I came up with should, on a graph, be a curve. This way of calculating flattens the stretch between the already fixed points.

Apart from that, a carbon date 7000 - 5000 BC = roughly a Biblically revised carbon date of 2632 - 2464 BC. Two millennia reduced to less than two hundred years. And I suppose that the set of flutes has not been dated in the flutes themselves, but that the place they were found in has been dated by similarity to a culture elsewhere carbon dated at 7000 - 5000 BC. Supposing the flutes were dated themselves, that would mean that a double flute either had been 2000 years between the one which is original and the one which is repair or less than 200 years, much more realistic. But I hope Zhang et al. back in 1999 didn't miss such a thing. So, I hope for their sake, the dating of the flute set is not carbon dating on the flutes themselves.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
St. John Chrysostom*
27.I.2017

* I could also have taken St Angela Merici, but since this is music, and since the patron Saint of Johannes Chrysostomus Wolfgang Gottlieb Mozart, better known as Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart is St John Chrysostom ...

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